There is a new device from Slim Devices called "Duet" that pairs a really nice wifi remote with a streaming player. The streaming player in the 'Duet' looks to me like a Squeezebox with no display... which you wouldn't need if you're using the fancy remote. The remote connects to your SlimServer which has controls to switch between your Duet's, SB3's and Transporters. The official release is here: http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/172/4180
I was fortunate enough to get in on the end of the beta program and recently received the "Jive" remote. I don't have the new player, just the remote. There is no 'SB4' from what I've read and the SB3 isn't going to change.
The remote is about as sexy as it gets... It's nicely backlit with crisp/clear indications for what each button does. The screen is color and shows album art if you have it.
Navigation is very similar to the menus you're used to with any Slim products... You go to 'Browse' then 'Artists' and find all your artists listed just like before... But now you have a wheel (similar to ipod's) that you turn to scroll through the list... It works well for me, I didn't need any instructions getting it setup or using it. I haven't gotten deep into yet, though.. I'm just playing music. The only downside is the number of albums I have makes scrolling a bit tedious. I'm wondering if there's a way to scroll faster.. I'll bet there is... I'll report back when I know.
I had some friends over who quickly started adding songs to playlists and making more use of the remote. You could then easily scroll through the playlist that had little album art icons next to each song... very cool. It wasn't long till we were fighting over control of the remote. ;)
Anyway, just wanted to post some initial impressions.. I'll add more later.
-C
How have you found the battery life? Heard a couple things saying it's about 2 hours for the remote. If that's the case, would be nice to have a cradle for recharging.
Bryan
Here's a link to the specs and yes, it does include a charging cradle for the remote...
http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speakers_audio/wireless_music_systems/devices/3817&cl=us,en (http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speakers_audio/wireless_music_systems/devices/3817&cl=us,en)
Very slick but at $400, I wonder how it will compete against the SB3? ($300 just for the remote controller).
Yeah, battery life is short-ish so far for me... seems like 2 hours is about when it needs a recharge.
However, it does come with a base as noted by Mike... and I agree it is expensive at $300... but the pair at $400 is a very reasonable value proposition to me. If you could buy an SB3 with the standard remote for 300, vs. 100 more to get the remote/player pair... I think it'd be an obvious choice to spend a little extra...
I've started using the 'search' feature to get to the music faster.. it's working for me... and I put the remote back in the base when I'm not using it so the battery life is a non-issue now.
-C
Schweet.
Bryan
In addition to the remote, it also has a new DAC from Wolfson, 6V output up from SB 2V, and no noisy flourescent display. It will be fun to hear it and compare. I am ready to order it right now!
Rich
I've never used a SB or similar device.... Is there a difference between the DUET and the Transporter if you simply use them to feed your DAC?
You can use the Duet (http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_duet.html) as a transport just like the Transporter, SB3 or SB2.
I'm not sure what the perceived sonic differences would be... but the Transporter probably uses a better clock than the SB3 or Duet... but I don't know for sure...
I know that a transport makes a difference to me. The SB3 and Transporter sounded a little different when I compared them on the same DAC, even though they 'shouldn't have'... and a PC with a good sound card using XP and Foobar sounds different as well. It's a splitting-hairs difference to some and a big deal to others...
-C
Well, that's the thing. The transporter or the Duet/SB is not a transport - that's the PC. The SB/transporter (if using digital out to external DAC) is really just a human/remote control interface and a FLAC decoder coupled to a network appliance with a buffer.
Bryan
The PC stores the music and serves it to the client device so it is part of the tranport but not the whole transport... and in my opinion the PC is only a small part during real-time playback.
The PC makes the (music) data available to the device. Once the device gets it, it controls how the bits are transported to the DAC. So, the SB3, TP, or Duet are functioning more as a transport than the PC.
I don't know how much is cached in the SB3/duet/TP device but if it's more than a few seconds, the PC becomes even less meaningful.
-C
Ya wanna see how much cache? If you're running wired, pull your network cable while it's playing. You'll get 15 seconds or more.
To me, the PC IS the transport because it serves the data. That's a transport's job - feed the DAC. The SB is nothing more than an interface allowing you to use the remote, strips off the network packetization, and feeds the data to the digital outputs. Yes, it has a buffer, but that should do nothing but provide robustness for short periods of network instability.
A matter of semantics.
Bryan
We're just in need of new semantics... in CD land, a 'transport' was both a server (extracting data from the CD) and a transport (transport the data to the DAC). So I like Carl's thinking of the SB/Transporter as more of a transport where the PC is a server (serving data to the transport).
Either way, hard-disk based audio has invented a new set of capabilities in need of well defined terms.
Carl,
If I remember right, you've got a bunch of SB3s floating around your home. Does the new remote make it easy to control each of them individually and/or synced? I do that via my laptop computer but even with the new SqueezeCenter v7, it's still not the most elegant user interface around (but better than v6.5). I'm curious to see how well they've implemented the UI on the new Jive remote.
Quote from: mdconnelly on January 08, 2008, 02:42:47 PM
Carl,
If I remember right, you've got a bunch of SB3s floating around your home. Does the new remote make it easy to control each of them individually and/or synced? I do that via my laptop computer but even with the new SqueezeCenter v7, it's still not the most elegant user interface around (but better than v6.5). I'm curious to see how well they've implemented the UI on the new Jive remote.
I'm controlling all 3 very easily. To switch SB3's, you just select "choose player" from the main menu.. then it lists them. It takes about 3 seconds to change between players. Right now I've got them all sync'd which you can also do from the remote. It's clear which device you're controlling from the Jive remote also, which is nice. For instance "Family Room" shows up at the top of the menus when I'm choosing music to play, etc.
Since I've gotten this remote I haven't looked at the Slimserver software at all... I guess I should. ;)
edit... Oh, one other thing that's cool is when I change the channel with the regular SB remote, the Jive remote's 'now playing' updates with whatever I've changed it to and displays it. You'll need to hit the 'home' button on the remote to get back to the controls if you want start changing things from there...
-C
So don't you need to be running the SqueezeCenter 7 beta for the Jive remote to work or is it working against 6.5?
Sounds like the remote is something I'm definitely going to want once it's available...
Quote from: mdconnelly on January 09, 2008, 06:10:28 AM
So don't you need to be running the SqueezeCenter 7 beta for the Jive remote to work or is it working against 6.5?
Sounds like the remote is something I'm definitely going to want once it's available...
You have to use 7 (still in Beta but downloadable and stable) which is causing my NAS friends fits. If you use a PC as your Slimserver, the update is painless.
I can't see not having it now. If I'm on the deck and want to change the channel... and need a flashlight... this remote is your friend. ;)
Seriously having a non-line-of-site remote that works ANYwhere in or around the house is very cool... the fact that it shows what's playing, let's you browse your music, shows photos of the albums, etc... It's "all that"..
Quote from: mdconnelly on January 09, 2008, 06:10:28 AM
So don't you need to be running the SqueezeCenter 7 beta for the Jive remote to work or is it working against 6.5?
Sounds like the remote is something I'm definitely going to want once it's available...
Maybe you can get one for $20? ;) http://www.audionervosa.com/index.php?topic=821.0
I'm still waiting for the FreeNAS/SlimNAS version to come out so I can update my server as well.
I'm hoping it'll all come together in February. New NAS software... Duet release.. etc.. If it doesn't I'll be pretty surprised.
-C
I'll still use SlimNAS so I need to wait for Michael Herger to finish the installer. I've seen plenty of screen shots of SC and I like it, I just don't want to make the jump with my stuff yet.
NOW Duet!
Slim is now accepting pre-orders for Feb. delivery.
https://secure.slimdevices.com/order/index.cgi
I just ordered. :D
Rich
The receiver is here... and to my surprise so is a new remote. The remote might fix a few things the beta testers have noted but all Logitech says is that it has 'improved wireless range'. I'll be interested to see if it works better than before... 'BLuisana' has the Jive at the moment and was having some NAS issues... I'll either get the battery/charger from him and try again or see if he can test it. (Quick definition: Jive=Remote, Receiver=Player with no display... Jive+Receiver=Duet)
The receiver requires use of the remote to set it up. I guess they're paired somehow. There's no way to setup the device on my network without it... So, I won't be able to compare it until I get the remote.
The receiver/new remote requires the latest software from Slim. The receiver won't work on releases before 1/5/08.
I'm not sure where Slim is on the NAS software... Does anyone know? If so, please post some links and suggestions about Slim/Logi's NAS solution.
They're uploading new server-based software every night here: http://www.slimdevices.com/downloads/nightly/latest/7.0/ The updates will be frequent for the next 2-4 weeks according to the letter. They're definitely getting close to releasing this... I'm amazed at the amount of work that's going into this launch... and the amount of community participation.
-Carl
Infrant is pretty good about providing slimserver updates for their ReadyNAS once the software is out of beta and classified as official release. But nothing before then. I will use the PC until the NAS catches up. I wonder if the new slimserver will make my NAS even slower. :?
I just ordered an Intel mini-itx board to test this on. It's 1.33ghz mobile Celeron that should pull about 10 watts for the whole board. The only problem is this board only has 1 ide channel (so 2 ide devices) and no SATA. I'll need to add a pci SATA board for the other drives. Once I get the hardware I'll document the build in the PC hardware section as to not clutter this post up.
Sounds interesting, Nick.. .looking forward to it. :)
-C