Tell me more about your Hattor. I'm intrigued :thumb:
Dear Evan, 9:00 am on the east coast is a wonderful time of day. 6:00 am on the west coast, not as much 🥱
Actually I have light filtering drapes on the bedroom sliding glass door, so I am awakened naturally 🌞 rather than traumatically ⏰
Now, as to my Hattor Big, it's a greater invention than sliced bread. I really like it! Built like a tank and mine is stylish as well. A high quality and very smartly designed remote. I had a 6ns7 Supratek Chardonnay for a few years and that was very good and a great introduction to the 6ns7 tube, which I became very fond of. I think a big difference in performance may lie in the Chardonnay's use of an old Alps pot. The Hattor resolves better and allows a more realistic presentation of the original recording imho. Now I am not talking about the Hattor being etched or harsh in any way because it resolves more detail. I am simply saying that it is nice to be surprised to hear instruments in the back of the stage that I had not heard before and some accompanying voices that are now distinguishable as well. Those are things that I appreciate and in a way it is an homage to those artists in that original recording that I never knew were present before I got my Hattor.
Now I have been trying various cables as well and have settled on using the Neotech silver/gold. They replace the WyWires Silver level (actually made of copper) and the Silver is the second from the bottom in Alex S line of cables. These custom Neotech wire interconnects are quieter and also resolve better. I am keeping the noise down from the start by using Dave's UberBUSS and Pete's Digital American II power cord. So my system is a work in progress and also sounding quite good right now. I'm sure there are better preamps out there than my Hattor Big, but I don't want to pay the price to find out.... 💰
I have decided to try the Lumin directly to my amp since it incorporates Leadh vulume control and see how this works. I will not be able to try it till next week as I am heading out of town for a week.
Quote from: ejk on February 27, 2025, 05:38:28 AM
I have decided to try the Lumin directly to my amp since it incorporates Leadh vulume control and see how this works. I will not be able to try it till next week as I am heading out of town for a week.
Well, Lumin is well regarded and I had to look up the specifics on the leedh volume control. I looked over the description a couple of times and see that it's also licensed to a number of companies as well.
Let us know if you like it better than your very good Aric 6ns7 preamp
Update. I tried the Leedh Volume control into my preamp with the volume maxed out on th Aric preamp at 47 steps. It was very low volume around 55db. Yesterday I borrowed Depak's Hator Big Pre and used it in active and passive mode on the Quicksilvers and the Pass labs and it just wasn't what I was looking for. I thought it would be really transparent as a passive. Just not my cup of tea. Just now I directed the Lumin via DAC directly to the Pass Labs and bypassing the preamp. Beautiful sound. Very open sounding. I have a remote coming Monday for the Lumin so I will be able to adjust volume without using the Lumin app. I could live with this setup in addition to my preamp. It's all about mood and choices. My main reason for trying this was to see how a solid-state preamp would sound in my system since I never had one.
Quote from: ejk on March 09, 2025, 02:25:59 PM
Update. I tried the Leedh Volume control into my preamp with the volume maxed out on th Aric preamp at 47 steps. It was very low volume around 55db. Yesterday I borrowed Depak's Hator Big Pre and used it in active and passive mode on the Quicksilvers and the Pass labs and it just wasn't what I was looking for. I thought it would be really transparent as a passive. Just not my cup of tea. Just now I directed the Lumin via DAC directly to the Pass Labs and bypassing the preamp. Beautiful sound. Very open sounding. I have a remote coming Monday for the Lumin so I will be able to adjust volume without using the Lumin app. I could live with this setup in addition to my preamp. It's all about mood and choices. My main reason for trying this was to see how a solid-state preamp would sound in my system since I never had one.
This is an interesting hobby. Each of us has different musical tastes, ears, rooms, experience levels, equipment, cables, power conditioners, etc etc.
I am surprised by your results with the Aric and Hattor preamps. I love my maxxed out Hattor Big, but I've not tried going direct. I have also never trusted a digital volume control enough either. I just like using a preamp and having the Hattor has me quite content. With the equipment and wires that I have, I only like the Hattor in active mode and at +9db. I expect now that I'll be trying ethernet noise control devices, my appreciation of the Hattor might even increase.
Keep us posted if you will continue to enjoy it in the long run. And if you want a change for while, what your second choice system would be.
Well I would add Evan has room that is perfect for evaluating gear. For me I want as close to live as possible. Hate, bright, dry, lean, fat or colored. Transparency with proper tone and harmonics. I wanna hear the decay of the harmonic.
Well so far exactly what I get. Lucky me.
charles
Quote from: rollo on March 10, 2025, 12:56:40 PM
Well I would add Evan has room that is perfect for evaluating gear. For me I want as close to live as possible. Hate, bright, dry, lean, fat or colored. Transparency with proper tone and harmonics. I wanna hear the decay of the harmonic.
Well so far exactly what I get. Lucky me.
charles
It's nice that some guys have a dedicated, acoustically treated room. I've never been fortunate enough, but may be someday I'll have one just for audio. My audio system has always shared time in the living room. It appears I have enough transparency right now, holographic presentation etc. I would like better performance as to harmonics.
I'm finding using my Lumin streamer as a preamp very engaging. Warm, and lots of air.
Quote from: ejk on March 11, 2025, 05:55:22 AM
I'm finding using my Lumin streamer as a preamp very engaging. Warm, and lots of air.
Glad you are enjoying it so much. I've heard good things about the Aries. Have you tried or known anyone who's used the G1 or G2 streamers? That might be the next step up for me .... buying used only.
Quote from: Nick B on March 11, 2025, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: ejk on March 11, 2025, 05:55:22 AM
I'm finding using my Lumin streamer as a preamp very engaging. Warm, and lots of air.
Glad you are enjoying it so much. I've heard good things about the Aries. Have you tried or known anyone who's used the G1 or G2 streamers? That might be the next step up for me .... buying used only.
That would be a great step up. Pricey. I don't know anyone who uses the Aries. The Lumin was in my price range used and the only reason I ended up with it was that for years I used Bliesound and I never believed a streamer would make a difference so I bought one after friends nagging me and they were right.
Quote from: ejk on March 11, 2025, 12:30:26 PM
Quote from: Nick B on March 11, 2025, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: ejk on March 11, 2025, 05:55:22 AM
I'm finding using my Lumin streamer as a preamp very engaging. Warm, and lots of air.
Glad you are enjoying it so much. I've heard good things about the Aries. Have you tried or known anyone who's used the G1 or G2 streamers? That might be the next step up for me .... buying used only.
That would be a great step up. Pricey. I don't know anyone who uses the Aries. The Lumin was in my price range used and the only reason I ended up with it was that for years I used Bliesound and I never believed a streamer would make a difference so I bought one after friends nagging me and they were right.
I just checked used pricing on HiFi Shark for the G1 and G2. In the $2,000+ range for the G1 and $4,000+ for the G2. Storage is included, which I don't need as I keep that on my Apple desktop. A better bet for me might be to see if Holo comes out with a better streamer. They will have more reasonable pricing.
The improvement from the Auralic Mini to the iFi Zen to the Holo Red has been consistent and revelatory. I am certainly now a believer in streamers.
Nick
I've owned five different Aries models since 2015 with the G2.2 in the Main system being the latest. There has been a steady upgrade in quality as the years have passed and the models have changed. Haven't heard any rumors in a long time about an upgraded Holo streamer but there is a new streamer coming from Laiv coming in Quarter 3 of this year. They are a safe bet to deal with whether buying direct or through Alvin at Vinshine. The Red is going to be hard to beat without a significant jump in price. I'm still running my Red via JPlay for IOS into the Spring 3 KTE along side the G2.2/Harmony combo.
Quote from: Jack on March 11, 2025, 06:17:01 PM
Nick
I've owned five different Aries models since 2015 with the G2.2 in the Main system being the latest. There has been a steady upgrade in quality as the years have passed and the models have changed. Haven't heard any rumors in a long time about an upgraded Holo streamer but there is a new streamer coming from Laiv coming in Quarter 3 of this year. They are a safe bet to deal with whether buying direct or through Alvin at Vinshine. The Red is going to be hard to beat without a significant jump in price. I'm still running my Red via JPlay for IOS into the Spring 3 KTE along side the G2.2/Harmony combo.
Jack,
Even a used G1 Aries at $2,000 and above is a bit more than I would want to spend. The Laiv would be an option as their dac received so many favorable comments and reviews, except for Hans B iirc. Oh, are you using the Hoer-Wege power supply on that G2.2?
By the time I get my remaing cables, amp to audition, ethernet filtering devices and try HQ Player, the timing should work out well.
$2000 seems a bit high for any of the G1 series but haven't looked at prices lately. With the G2.2 Auralic implemented a entirely new twin PS system eliminating the need for the Hoer-Wege PS upgrade for that unit. I do however have a G1 that I installed the Hoer-Wege PS in and it did make a noticeable improvement.
As to the upcoming Laiv streamer I expect it to be more than competitive in the marketplace as well as being well thought out and well built. As to Han's review of the Laiv it was a one of anomaly and his description didn't resemble anything I heard nor any of the other reviewers or owners I know of. As his comparison was to Holo DACs of which I own two it just didn't fit what I have heard using the two companies DACs in multiple setups.
Quote from: Jack on March 11, 2025, 07:19:00 PM
$2000 seems a bit high for any of the G1 series but haven't looked at prices lately. With the G2.2 Auralic implemented a entirely new twin PS system eliminating the need for the Hoer-Wege PS upgrade for that unit. I do however have a G1 that I installed the Hoer-Wege PS in and it did make a noticeable improvement.
As to the upcoming Laiv streamer I expect it to be more than competitive in the marketplace as well as being well thought out and well built. As to Han's review of the Laiv it was a one of anomaly and his description didn't resemble anything I heard nor any of the other reviewers or owners I know of. As his comparison was to Holo DACs of which I own two it just didn't fit what I have heard using the two companies DACs in multiple setups.
You're right on the prices. Went to HiFi Shark and they are lower. Not sure what site I got the other information from. I had a hunch Auralic would improve their power supply so an aftermarket unit would no longer be necessary.
If/when a Laiv streamer comes out, I'll take a look. I don't think Hans B took a second look at that Laiv dac. I still enjoy his reviews and he seems quite credible in his opinions. Usually I look for multiple reviews on a product anyway.
Nick
My issues with the review were twofold. First his description of the Laiv as "bright" compared to the Holo which it is not. It is in fact side by side in the same system slightly "warmer" than the Holo's. Secondly neither of these companies DACs are forward or bright in any way. They all three fit in the same sound profile segment as my Aqua La Voce S3 which is what draw me to them to start with. One thing I have found out the hard way and you and I have talked about is that as great as it may be no USB cable is the same from DAC to DAC. In my Main system, which has both a Holo and the Laiv installed, I can switch back and forth easily enough by swapping the same USB cable from DAC to DAC but found out in this system as I already new from prior experimentation the same cable was not the best fit for both DACs. That could have been part of Han's findings as could many other things that he didn't appear to explore. Instead he seemed to be glad to be the outlier in that no one else has reporting hearing what he heard. Anyway as they had a 30 day no questions asked return policy with free shipping trying it was a no brainer. In the end I'm glad I did.
Quote from: Jack on March 12, 2025, 07:01:06 PM
Nick
My issues with the review were twofold. First his description of the Laiv as "bright" compared to the Holo which it is not. It is in fact side by side in the same system slightly "warmer" than the Holo's. Secondly neither of these companies DACs are forward or bright in any way. They all three fit in the same sound profile segment as my Aqua La Voce S3 which is what draw me to them to start with. One thing I have found out the hard way and you and I have talked about is that as great as it may be no USB cable is the same from DAC to DAC. In my Main system, which has both a Holo and the Laiv installed, I can switch back and forth easily enough by swapping the same USB cable from DAC to DAC but found out in this system as I already new from prior experimentation the same cable was not the best fit for both DACs. That could have been part of Han's findings as could many other things that he didn't appear to explore. Instead he seemed to be glad to be the outlier in that no one else has reporting hearing what he heard. Anyway as they had a 30 day no questions asked return policy with free shipping trying it was a no brainer. In the end I'm glad I did.
There are a handful of guys online whose opinions I trust for the most part and reviews I enjoy. Guys like OCD Mikey, the Serbian? iiWi, Srjajen from 6 Moons, Steve Huff even with his hyperbole and Hans B and some others. But it's more useful to get your opinion and some of the other guys here. You especially have seen my tastes morph and develop a bit over time. It's still a process for me, but the last couple of years have been fun.
I love the Cyan2 and especially for the money. But your description of the Laiv and it being on the warmer side is very appealing. I would not want anything more neutral or bright than my Cyan2. As I am learning, system synergy is very important and I am keeping most of my cables nowadays for different systems in the future.
And from everything I've read the Cyan II has the same basic "house sound" as the Spring 3 and the May. Though the May with it's separate heavy power supply may give me that "last 5 to 10 percent" in detail in many ways I prefer the overall presentation of the middle child, the Spring 3 KTE. Plus you don't to worry about having a separate place for the power supply. As it get very warm you really don't want to set the DAC unit on top of it. In some ways I was really hoping that Christian would take the La Voce one more step at least to the S4 but it appears that it has been dropped from the line up altogether.
Quote from: Jack on March 12, 2025, 09:03:50 PM
And from everything I've read the Cyan II has the same basic "house sound" as the Spring 3 and the May. Though the May with it's separate heavy power supply may give me that "last 5 to 10 percent" in detail in many ways I prefer the overall presentation of the middle child, the Spring 3 KTE. Plus you don't to worry about having a separate place for the power supply. As it get very warm you really don't want to set the DAC unit on top of it. In some ways I was really hoping that Christian would take the La Voce one more step at least to the S4 but it appears that it has been dropped from the line up altogether.
The Cyan2 has been a very pleasant surprise and thanks for that recommendation. It's allowed me to get a flavor of the Holo line for a budget price. I know you've enjoyed the Aqua La Voce and I believe Charles likes it as well. I am curious if the Laiv is at least the equal or even better than the La Voce S3 in some regards. I will soon be getting HQ Player which will allow for a lot of experimentation and on a budget level for me.
We've bounced around a bit on this thread including streamers, switches etc. Maybe I'll start a different thread sometime, but the iFi LAN iSilencer ($89) and the iFi LAN iPurifier Pro ($299) are an excellent noise reduction combination. New speaker cables are also breaking in with 100+ hours so far.
Of the songs so far I've been listening to this evening, the background has been very black with excellent resolution even deep into the soundstage. The presentation has been grain free and tonally rich among other things. Great value for the money by the iFi guys.
Oh, I should mention that JPLAY is definitely better than Roon as a lot of guys have said. I was unsure before, but definitely a believer now.