Ice is nice!

[shep]

I'm all alone here Well I'm no stranger to talking to myself! Hey self, the amp is burning in nicely. Well past the 150 hour mark and beginning to sing. I put a better power cord I had on it and that took things up a notch, played with speaker positioning, which didn't do much but confuse me.
I'm dying to replace the Clarity SA caps on the speaker cross-over with something really high-class but the ones I would like cost more than the whole system! Anybody got some Clarity MR (2) in 3.9uF they want to sell? Or I'll shovel the snow off your driveway! that's already a step in the right direction. (the MR's not the driveway) Fun talking to the ether. Hey the maleman was more communicative. 

[miklorsmith]

Maleman?  Ha!  What other kind is there?

I was responding to your comment "I wish I could write a proper review . . ."  Sorry for the mistake, carry on!

[shep]

gracious I'm not alone!

[Black Sand Cable]

Room for one more? 

[shep]

I should think so! got any nice sexy cables???  Nice steaming cup of coffee?
Where did al the patients go? and those nice doctors? Is there a convention or something?
I will drag myself out of the silliness ward and put on my audiophile "mask"... you know, the serious, earnest one. I feel like I've been having this conversation, in one form or another, for the past 30 years.
So back to an ice amp: I've been scouring the web for any and all user impressions. Some are dismissive, some are exstatic, some straddle the line. I have a hard time putting a finger or words to its sonic signature.
It isn't perfect by any means (but we know that doesn't yet exist and is highly subjective and dependant on innumerable factors) but it is very listenable. I will concur with one criticism that seems to be generalized;
the upper treble is rolled offand a bit too polite. In general it's rather on the warm, dry side of the fence, which is a strange combination. Not warm as in forgiving or cuddly though. Space and soundstaging are first class and rhere's lots of texture, details. In this respect it is much better than the Tripath chip. The bass is dry and tight and maybe just a little bit too much so, but again there are the speakers and the room. It is most impressive in the mid_bass and up. Voices are very natural and convincing. There is still a slight veil and a touch of acidity which is slowly dispersing. One very impressive characterisitic of this amp is how it handles dynamic contrast and seems to have total composure, no matter how loud it goes.
I think I'm running out of purple prose! In total, I realy enjoy this amp and I can only invite all malemen (especially those at the mystery convention) to have a listen to a good example of the Ice amps and judge for yourselves)

[shep]

Just to add a note to the above. Critical listening: In fact if I had to be picky I would say the dryness I spoke of might be the one feature that bothers me. I don't know how to put it otherwise. If wish I had other cables to check this out further. Notably I'm not now convinced that Grover's ic's are the best match. It could also be my solid-core speaker cables. I've just no way of knowing. This is very frustrating! I would like to try the new flat copper "wires" from Dan Wright (which only cost the double of my speakers!) this is an insane hobby

[richidoo]

I've been out sick and Carlman is predisposed with family matters.

Rolling off of high frequencies is common with class D amps is due to rising output impedance into higher frequencies. A speaker whose impedance rises with freq will sound better on an amp that does the same thing. You could add a resistor to your speakers to increase the impedance as an experiment, but it would have to be high power low distortion ($) and it would reduce the volume and probably mute dynamics to some degree. There is a lot of development going on of output filter and feedback to lower output impedance and distortion at high freqs.

In my experience, the Grover ICs are very revealling, and when they are objectionable it is due to something in the system being revealled that prefers to remain hidden. But you can't just hide one thing, some good is always flushed with the bad.

[miklorsmith]

Shep, see if you can find a tubed preamplifier to put in front of that thing.  I mean literally any tubed preamp.  If you happen to find a good one, all the better.  It WILL change the sound and it WILL give you a data point for triangulation.  You may not like it better but you may like some of what it does.  Dryness to me says "no tubes" or "not enough".

Personally, I wouldn't try to fix things with wires.  They certainly can whisper one direction or another but their effects are quite random and unless you're going in with both feet your chances of stumbling across the perfect fit are slim.

[shep]

well put all. Tube pre. is out of the question since this is an "integrated" with the pot an integral part. I can live with this sound and it hasn't reached it's potential yet. Yes wires are a hit or miss unless one has access to a lot and a lot of time to spend. Damn it's cold here. Well Ny will be even more so but there's central heating. Enough of this neurotic behavior for a while. I'm going to see a girl-friend. That is a zillion times more interesting than an"ice" amp!

[miklorsmith]

Heh, but who "speaks to you" really.  I mean really.

The pot on your amp is just a "gain attenuator" really.  My main amps have the same thing, they're one-input integrated amps just like yours.  Also, they're switching amps like yours.  And, I'm guessing like yours REALLY benefit from a superior tubed preamplifier.

[shep]

  A passive front end "resists" the output. Each resistor step "up" is less resistance. At ful vol. there is no resistance. There is no physical way to put an active preamp in front of this amp. Anyway its getting better and better. I am hearing the design limitations of the speakers. I could change the sound quite radicaly by playing with caps in the crossover but this entails expense and rather delicate work that I'm not up for.
I think I will just relax and accept that I have a unique, one of a kind integrated amp that sounds way above it's price. I read somewhere that ice modules can take as much as 1000hours to be truly settled so...

[shep]

Nervosa intensified
Having discovered that the gent behind Wyred audio (of ICEamp fame), is very approachable, I approached... well because I found that the leading-edge of the bass was soft on my amp (yeah I know, this way madness lies) which led to an intense ich to send it to him to upgrade. It seems that one "problem" associated with the passive-pre. approach and these amps requires a solution which he has implimented;namely buffer stages between the pot and the gain stage. Help! I am resisting the itch. the solution is costly, time consumning and a bitch to organize. Otherwise the amp is a marvel of transparency and musicality. Just thought y'all would want to know. By the way, I take off for New York Monday and will be off-line so wishing every one of you a merry, safe and sober (yes indeed) holliday season.

[richidoo]

Happy Holidays to you too shep. Have a safe trip, and I hope you find all the work you can handle.  Don't forget to stop for a breath of fresh air once in a while. As fresh as NYC air is anyway...  Try to take in some music, NYC is the jazz capital of the world. There is lots of small club action that is not too expensive.

Wyred's solution will be to add an active gain stage ahead of the power stage. Judging from Wyred reviews that I have read, I bet it would sound excellent, but it won't be a Mardis or a Wyred product then, just a best guess mod. So from a financial perspective you might be better off selling yours and getting a real Wyred.

[Carlman]

Try to get in touch with some of the NY Audio Rave guys while you're visiting.. a great bunch of folks for sure.
Here's to safe travels! 
-C

[shep]

thankee kindly. The hell with amps. I'm going to the opera with lady...Mozart. I'll worry about hi'fi later. My next DIY project will be doing a simple mod to the crossover of the speakers; replacing Vishay coupling cap with Jenzen or other. Cheap and effective way to avoid boredom!