Single Branded Systems vs Separates

[rollo]

  We have read over the years reviews of various components. The components for the most part were inserted into a system synergy to sound a certain way. When component "A" is inserted the synergy is held or broken. The reviewer can only describe the affect of the inserted component not the component itself.
   Saying that when a manufacture offers a complete line of gear would not it be better to review a system as opposed to a single offering ? Once in a while we will read a review of say a preamp and amp used together.
   We all now that synergy is more important than a single component. Now inserting that component may have synergy with the system. We have that experience. Tubed pre and SS amp as an example.
  Are we missing the boat though ? When is the last time an entire one brand system was heard using your speakers ? An all Audio Research or CJ, Bryston, MBL, Melody, Audio Note,  or any brand.
   I'm curious to hear a CDP, Pre and amp from one brand. As well as a manf who offers speakers as well.  Their perception of sound as a whole.
   So instead of trying to find the components that go together well why not find a house sound that floats your boat instead ?
    The sound as a whole from a manf. I believe best represents their effort as opposed to a single component. Companies like Audio Note, Sumiko and TAD are prime examples. Would like to see more reviews of complete systems.


charles
   

[Barry (NJ)]

What about Naim? They offer complete systems from source to transducer...

[Regg]

When I ordered an amp from Klaus Bunge a few years back, 'synergy' was one of the first words to come out of his mouth. I've been told by a few ears I trust that an all Odyssey system does indeed achieve that.

On the other hand, I recently heard an amp/preamp combo from a well-regarded manufacturer that I thought was totally underwhelming, lifeless & boring...quite the polar opposite of what I expected.

I'm constantly having to re-evaluate my pre-conceived notions in this hobby. Synergy is in the ear of the beholder, including those of the manufacturers.

[rollo]

What about Naim? They offer complete systems from source to transducer...

  Linn, Naim and lots more. 



charles

[Barry (NJ)]

Synergy is in the ear of the beholder, including those of the manufacturers.

That's the reality of it

[JLM]

As this relates to synergy, I recommend looking into active speakers as this is where the biggest synergy exists IMO.

Plus active speakers have their own advantages (low level crossover(s), amps directly "view" the simplier load from each driver, amps are selected/designed by the manufacturer, less power loss, possible EQ/alignment delays, overload protection, no speaker cables needed) that lead to improved dynamics, flat frequency response, and deeper/more bass.

[topround]

I think synergy is far more complex than just matching names

[mac5u]

I think synergy is far more complex than just matching names

I don't think anyone would disagree with that, but buying gear from various manufacturers hoping that it all "clicks" can be very expensive, time consuming, and a real crapshoot at the end of the day.

Why not go all-in with a single manufacturer?  For example, Naim has a certain kind of sound.  If you like that sound, why wouldn't the manufacturer be in the best position to really dial-in a certain kind of sound across components?

It won't always work, but I'm with rollo, it would be interesting to see more reviews or discussions along these lines. 

For someone just starting out, it could well be a very good place to begin.
--Michael

[topround]

I agree that a manufacturer would probably match components to work together, and I am sure it would(should) sound good together. But we strive for more.
Otherwise we would all have same brand systems

[mac5u]

But isn't the "more", in a nutshell, synergy?  If it can be found in an all-in system...?

I'm just saying the idea should not be discarded because it might not meet some pre-conceived notion (not saying you are) about how to achieve it (synergy).  

[mdconnelly]

Isn't synergy just another word that describes what we all are ultimately striving for?

It strikes me that a whole system engineered by someone who really knows what they're doing stands a better chance because, in theory, they better understand and design for synergy between all the components.  To be honest, I've not heard any single-brand systems from source to speaker.  Hmmm, such a system might just take half the fun out of this hobby 

But even if such synergistic single-brand systems existed, we'd still be coping with cables, power and, most important, the room we put it in.  And therein lies the Nervosa...

[topround]

remember that some brands "design" components because they want to fill their line. They may make great amps and preamps, then they come out with a cd player just to fill in the line and have another component to sell.
eg. , Audio Research makes electronic gear, would you buy their speakers?

Vandersteen makes speakers would you buy his amp?

Now Vandy could make a great amp and AR could make great speakers, but that is not their specialty.

I am not trying to knock the all one brand system, just playing devils advocate trying to bring up points to consider.

[rollo]

   How about AudioNote vs Sumiko or Pass vs MBL. Linn vs Naim.
   Or we take two speaker systems say Vanderstein 5A and  Maggie 3.7s and mate them with all Audio Research vs Conrad Johnson.
   It should prove very interesting. As far as cables the same applies. A full run from CDP to speaker of a single manf.vs another. The only time I personally tried this is when Shane  HTD sent our club a full set of JPS Labs cables from CDP to speaker. Each insertion of the JPS improved the sound.  The Aluminata speaker cable the last to be put in just bowled us over. A n Epiphany really. When we inserted different cables into the mix later on the sound deteriorated.
   Many good points so far keep them coming. For big Nervosa types this may not apply but maybe a worthwhile experience.
  Bryston surprised the crap out of us when an entire system including cables was demonstrated with two different speakers.


charles
 

[mac5u]

remember that some brands "design" components because they want to fill their line. They may make great amps and preamps, then they come out with a cd player just to fill in the line and have another component to sell.
eg. , Audio Research makes electronic gear, would you buy their speakers?

Fair enough but my comments were to rollo's original post about listening to a complete system through one's own speakers.  And even then, I wasn't sure if he meant that to include ICs and the lot.  I did not take it that way.

I don't know that one would get to audio nirvana by assembling a system sourced from one manufacturer.  Doing so means that you are going to have to trust the ear of the designer(s) to reproduce music that sounds like music and also suits you.  If it doesn't, then instead of audio nirvana, you have audionervosa.   

Sometimes, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts; sometimes it isn't.

Still, it would be interesting to listen, through one's own speakers, to an all-Naim, or AudioNote, Linn, Odyssey, etc. system.  Each will undoubtedly have its own sound.  Fascinating. 

Thanks to rollo for starting this thread.  As one who is considering either staring over from scratch for either my main system or the second system, it has given me something to think about. 

[bhobba]

I think synergy is far more complex than just matching names

Absolutely.

Personally I think buying from a single manufacturer more or less forces you to purchase from the big boys that make a wide range of products.  I generally eschew them these days because I believe the smaller guys are where it is all at.  For example my Patek amp for a measly $1.2k easily bests the big boy stuff I have have heard such as Rega etc.

That said because of that I am not really familiar with stuff from the larger manufacturers these days - they could quite easily have lifted their game.  I basically get to hear it when acquaintances bring it on over to check it out on my system.

Thanks
Bill